So, I was wondering what you guys think about vegeterianism. I'm a vegeterian, because I believe humans and animals are equal and we do not have the right to take their lives. I just wanted to know if you eat meat and why.

I have no problem with vegetarianism; I admire how well some stick to it. However, I still think saying that humans and animals are equal and therefore we should not kill them is a poor argument, not because I do not believe that we are (I neither believe nor disbelieve it), but because animals kill other animals, regardless. If we are to say we are equal to animals, then we must hold ourselves to the same standards as we do them and vice-versa.

I eat meat because humans are naturally omnivores, so it's healthier to eat meat. The body needs the nutrition that come from meats to be as healthy as possible. While these can come from supplements, supplements tend to be very expensive and I see no need for added cost with less benefit.

On top of that, I enjoy the taste of meat.

I have no problem with the idea of hundreds of animals being killed for my consumption (as is often the next thing people asks), as I value plant life, too. Any life that has passed should be given some respect, be it sentient or non-sentient. Simply because we do not know what it would be like to live as a plant being doesn't mean we should have any less respect for them: a sentient mind cannot comprehend a non-sentient mind. Why is it unethical to eat plants, but not meat? Just because you are sentient, do you place value on sentient beings over non-sentient?

You have some good points, I especially liked the bit about plants. I have thought about the value of plant life, however, I was never a huge fan of meat anyway, so being a veggie is easy, but I think it would be impossible to be a fruitarian (as fruit are not alive). And, yes, animals do eat other animals, but I think that where possible, we should limit slaughter. It would be impossible to tell an animal it wasn't allowed to eat meat. (Obviously.)

How are they not alive?

I don't really know a lot about it, but my sister told me that they don't have a brain or anything like that. I'll google it though.

You could say that a fruit is not alive as it is a separable part of the plant that produced it. On the other hand, it does contain a seed which is a new plant in miniature. So every time you eat fruit with a seed or a pit in it, you're eating baby plants. Hm.

Oh, dear. This really does change every thing.

Humans and animals are not equal. So should we stop exterminators? Humans are superior.

I'm not going to get in a debate about this, but I'm a Christian. God gave us the right to rule the earth.

Even if God weren't real, look at who's the smartest. Us or an aphid?

Hmm. I can't say I agree with your view. But, yes, you are right, it is best not to debate about it. I care too much about animals. It couldn't possibly end well.

If you're not willing to defend your opinion, you have no reason to put it up.

Humans are, in fact, animals.
/devil's advocate hat
How do we determine what species is 'smarter'? Since the concept of intelligence is manmade, what standard should we hold an animal to? If a mind works differently, that does not make it inferior. How important is being smart, anyway? Is it acceptable for those in the highest IQ bracket to eat those in the lowest IQ bracket? After all, they're smarter.

What seems unfair to me is that humans only eat perfectly innocent herbivores, such as sheep and cows. These are the animals that wouldn't eat you. Maybe humans are smarter, but maybe we aren't. Humans cause global warming, war, pain. Herbivores, in particular, would live peacefully if it weren't for humans. Maybe it is fair to eat meat, but how can you bare to eat it thinking of the animals sacrificed for you? If you had to kill all the animals you eat yourself, would you?

You should read 'Eating Animals' by Johnaton Safran Foer or 'Fast Food Nation' by Eric Schlosser. It might change your mind. Eating meat would be so much fairer if they had been raised organicly.

Haha I'd love to debate this with you, but this is not the place... I'll make a new thread later.

But they do, don't they? I am interested to read this thread you will be creating.

The problem with the title 'organic' for meat is that it doesn't have a set definition.

And organic farming is actually terrible for the environment, which never ceases to amuse me.

I prefer chicken and fish most of the time, but I do enjoy a good stake once in a while.

I was a vegetarian for a year and I honestly felt amazing. Due to a bad incident I am no longer one but I think I'll go back again sometime. I don't like meat that much nor do I like the idea of eating an animal that was once breathing, seeing and running. I also find cows and pigs adorable.

You are all discriminating against plants and bacteria!

...But seriously, I have lived on a vegetarian diet for extended periods of time (months at a time; I'm living on one right now). I don't agree that there's an absolute system of ethics, but I do follow an ethical code which is really ill-defined and ad hoc. As such, I am not a vegetarian.

I am now madly curious as to what kind of 'incident' would cause your diet to change.

My guess would be a bad mushroom or some other kind of food poisoning.

It would be nice if someone figured out how to, maybe by studying chlorophyll, let humans take energy from the Sun. That way we wouldn't have to kill other life forms.

I've thought about that... it would take a lot of genetics work to convince our skin cells to produce chlorophyll. And even then, you'd have all that newly-green skin dumping sucrose into your bloodstream every time you stand in the sun, which sounds like a recipe for FREE DIABETES AFTER MAIL-IN REBATE!

I'm leaning towards vegetarianism for more practical reasons. I simply don't like most meats. Beef especially disgusts me. Seafood and occasionally chicken and ham is pretty much it for me.

I'm at a science summer camp, pretty much this site in real life, and I was suprised at the number of smart people here who are vegetarian, a good number, we have about 30 kids and maybe 5 of them are dedicated vegetarians, and another ten or so avoid meat, but will eat it on occasion or on the side. Because of that, i'm interested if I could add myself to the ten that avoid meat. I doubt it though.

Well I am vegetarian, not because I don't like meat, but because I decided that it was better for me to not kill sentient life in order to live. As for plants, well everybody has a line in the sand, some people are happy to eat any meat, some people would not eat whales or dogs, some people don't eat red mean, my line in the sand just happens to be at plants. But I am generally fine with other people's eating choices.

A slightly better reason than the knee-jerk "poor little bunny rabbit" school, but I don't think it really holds water.

You have an unstated assumption:
If humans and animals are "equal" in some respect, then the standards should be the same.

That is debatable in its own right, but I'll stick with it.

Then comes:
We don't have the right to take their lives.

Is this for any purpose, or just for food? If only for food, why should that differ?

Proceeding to the main argument...

Since we are "equal", then presumably animals do not have the right to take other animal's lives. This would make all carnivores and omnivores immoral. Do you propose to convince them of the error of their ways? Punish them? Eliminate them?

If you could humanely eliminate all the natural meat eaters, what do you propose to do about the ever-expanding populations of the herbivores? Should the remaining (vegetarian) human population move over and allow them to graze out all "our" farmland? Should we cull them (oops, no killing, my bad), or keep them out somehow so they starve...?

We have evolved as omnivores. That gives us as much "right" to eat meat as any other omnivore.

I think there are strong reasons to eat a reduced-meat diet from both a health and an environmental perspective, but you'll need a very good counter-argument before I buy into animal rights as a valid justification.